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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
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Super Whopper
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Posted - 2011.03.27 11:39:00 -
[1]
CCP, never go full ******. You've gone full ******.
Devs who have no idea how to play the game should be fired.
Also if this idiotic game gets implemented I am going to petition the system I rat in because my alliance didn't fight so you could nerf our income. I will not stop petitioning until you change it or change the sec status of my system.
The only time this change will work is if there're lots of -1 systems, but there aren't. In the majority of the south east systems are absolutely worthless.
I just remembered something. The "We don't give a damn about the game" (18 months) full ****** comment earned you some really bad publicity. You've forgotten what that tastes like, time to remind you once again, as you just never, ever learn.
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Posted - 2011.03.27 11:53:00 -
[2]
Quote: It was mentioned by CCP that the data does not seem to support that polished quality sells better than new features. The discussion focused on introducing new features versus improving existing ones. CCP stated that once Incarna and planetary interaction with its link to Dust are fully implemented, focus will probably shift far more towards improvement of existing features.
I would like to remind you all this is CCP we're talking about.
So, clueless devs, are you boosting system sec status across the board or do you want us to petition our systems for lack of sanctums.
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Posted - 2011.03.27 15:18:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Super Whopper on 27/03/2011 15:25:40
Originally by: Kalle Demos Guys you are missing the point, sanctums were a risk free way for players to fund themselves to fight for their masters, while masters kept all the ISK and let it flow with moon goo.
Making it harder for NUMBERS to make isk means it will losses mean something, alliances will have to decide on whether it is worth living somewhere or not and if it isnt they can either leave or invade the good areas.
I mean really you guys are agreeing with CCPs decision anyway.
Almost all comments are "smaller alliances are screwed" therefore the only way for smaller alliances NOT to be screwed is either invade leaders, demand better space or leave, how is this a bad thing?
Besides theres more than one way to make ISK in 0.0
This change WILL make 0.0 less blobby as 'friends' will now have to make a choice in living in 0.0, either have **** space for friends, kill friends, demand better space or gtfo.
How is this even a bad thing?
From SHC, where people do know what they're talking about.
Doesn't count NPC sov systems in each region
A: 0.0 to -0.2 (no sanctums/havens!) B: -0.3 to -0.4 (probably havens but few or no sanctums) C: -0.5 to -0.6 (slightly worse than now) D: -0.7 to -0.8 (slightly better than now) E: -0.9 to -1.0 (much better than now)
Code:
| Region | A | B | C | D | E | | |----------------------+----+----+----+----+----+-----------| | The Spire | 3 | 9 | 28 | 18 | 14 | DRF (d) | | Cobalt Edge | 7 | 19 | 19 | 10 | 14 | DRF (d) | | Malpais | 8 | 22 | 27 | 34 | 11 | DRF (d) | | Perrigen Falls | 4 | 9 | 39 | 42 | 10 | DRF (d) | | Etherium Reach | 6 | 13 | 37 | 34 | 10 | DRF (d) | | The Kalevala Expanse | 6 | 16 | 19 | 17 | 10 | DRF (d) | | Outer Passage | 12 | 22 | 15 | 28 | 8 | DRF (d) | | Oasa | 12 | 16 | 24 | 24 | 8 | DRF (d) | | Delve | 16 | 10 | 20 | 16 | 8 | PL(for sale)| | Tenal | 27 | 17 | 9 | 7 | 8 | NC | | Feythabolis | 29 | 28 | 18 | 6 | 8 | CAAASEROL | | Branch | 17 | 25 | 25 | 20 | 7 | NC | | Period Basis | 9 | 11 | 6 | 3 | 7 | ? | | Cache | 17 | 11 | 6 | 1 | 7 | DRF | | Deklein | 7 | 6 | 22 | 27 | 6 | NC/DC | | Fountain | 43 | 21 | 14 | 8 | 6 | NC/DC | | Querious | 31 | 15 | 11 | 12 | 5 | ? | | Insmother | 37 | 27 | 30 | 10 | 4 | DRF | | Omist | 12 | 18 | 6 | 3 | 4 | DRF | | Vale of the Silent | 48 | 46 | 10 | 11 | 3 | NC | | Catch | 59 | 15 | 15 | 8 | 3 | CAAASEROL | | Esoteria | 30 | 20 | 15 | 6 | 3 | CAAASEROL | | Paragon Soul | 20 | 6 | 2 | 1 | 3 | CAAASEROL | | Tenerifis | 29 | 28 | 12 | 10 | 2 | CAAASEROL | | Detorid | 26 | 39 | 23 | 6 | 2 | DRF | | Scalding Pass | 30 | 15 | 10 | 6 | 2 | DRF | | Geminate | 26 | 28 | 13 | 3 | 2 | NC | | Immensea | 20 | 29 | 26 | 9 | 0 | DRF | | Wicked Creek | 22 | 38 | 15 | 7 | 0 | DRF | | Tribute | 27 | 14 | 6 | 7 | 0 | NC | | Impass | 21 | 19 | 7 | 3 | 0 | CAAASEROL | | Cloud Ring | 8 | 2 | 0 | 1 | 0 | NC/DC | | Fade | 2 | 20 | 5 | 0 | 0 | NC | | Providence | 68 | 12 | 0 | 0 | 0 | Ev0ke | | Pure Blind | 58 | 5 | 0 | 0 | 0 | NC/DC |
As you see, you haven't got the slightest clue what you're talking about. You see all those area's with all those horrible systems? They're going to be empty.
Well done CCP, you're going to depopulate 0Here's the graph but easier to read.
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Posted - 2011.03.27 15:44:00 -
[4]
Throwing away hundreds of ships means minerals are taken out of the market and used.
Currently ship destruction may be down but after the summer holidays at least one entity goes on a rampage also ship destruction may be down but actual financial/mineral loss is much higher, unless you're saying losing a titan/super cap fleet is as easy to replace as a fleet of BC's/BS's.
Therefore, you are simply wrong.
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Posted - 2011.03.27 16:01:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Daxation Here's a fabulous idea, give titans their AOE Doomsday back. It'll be a counter towards blobs. Granted they'd need to put coded features in to keep a single titan from annihilating 20 battleships with a single DD.
It is the price of minerals that determines how much super caps cost and they're not cheap already. The problem isn't cost of production, it's moon distribution. When PL were living in Venal they lost 8 titans and replaced them all immediately, because they were making more than they could lose. Now look at Providence and there's a MASSIVE problem.
Originally by: JackBlasta any longterm player using sanctums to keep themselves in ships is a maroon of the highest order imho. Once you have a decent amount of capital build up, its better to trade and play the contracts market. Although we're talking about the NC here so I guess my advice is wasted on the hordes of knownothings such as yourself. Just quit whining ffs though
Different play styles. How dare we! All you people out there mining, you heard it from some nub who thinks you should be doing something else because he says so.
If I wasn't so tired I'd find the Picard facepalm picture.
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Posted - 2011.03.27 16:17:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Super Whopper on 27/03/2011 16:25:17 Edited by: Super Whopper on 27/03/2011 16:20:49 Have you seen EVE's subscription? It's dropped and investors do care about that.
What doesn't the data compute again, CCP? We need more '18 months' blogs, because if CCP keep going like this the only thing that will be nerfed will be CCP themselves.
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Posted - 2011.03.27 16:42:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Shivalla Dear lord what amount of tears you managed to pack into single post.
Dude seriously, pull your head out of your ***, and look at the big picture.
A) Change B) Conflicts C) Eve is dying D) Has been for past 7 years. E) NC is crap. F) U mad?
You are mad, and so are CCP, literally.
I used to have 6 accounts. Now I have three. If this change is implemented I will drop another one or two.
So, there's one you missed: G) Lose subscribers.
Did you look at the graph I linked or too busy trolling?
The Space P0lice on Dotlan: 0 Systems. Empire alliance whining about changes that won't affect them.
Keep trolling, though.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 01:36:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Super Whopper on 28/03/2011 01:36:54
Originally by: Widemouth Deepthroat They weren't empty pre-Dominion, they won't be if this change goes through.
They were mostly empty back then, as they will be again. Most of the people who lived in those regions ran lvl 4 missions to support their pvp habits.
Originally by: Shivalla No no, I am not whining at all. I support this change completely. And I think you should indeed cancel your subscriptions. And sell all the chars aswell, to support your ISK making.
Trolling, well, that might be ![Cool](/images/icon_cool.gif)
Crying that others might be making more money than you, that's what it comes down to.
Originally by: Cyrus Doul
TLDR with that system losses of high end sites are DRF 30% loss across 15 regions PL 26% loss on one region NC 57% loss across seven regions CAAASEROL 50% loss across seven regions Nulli Secunda 33$ loss on one region DC 48% loss across 3 regions Ev0ke 93 percent loss on one region
All those people used to farm lvl 4 missions. Now that CCP want to move lvl 4's to low sec will mean those people will have to find something else to do, like macro mine or run lvl 3's.
When CCP realise that people have switched from lvl 4's to lvl 3's they'll nerf those too, until there's nobody left in the game.
At the end of the day CCP have been bleeding subscribers. Incarna is just a desperate attempt at getting people into the game. That attempt will fail, because CCP have no clue what goes on in the game that is EVE, so, it's not their game, it's OUR game. If it's their game let them play it, after all a couple of devs and executives are enough to keep all their investors happy and the servers running.
If CCP don't start listening to us, their players, even more will quit and will find other games to play. Sony also thought, in their arrogance, they could get more people to SWG by making sweeping changes to the game. The game is now a wasteland and CCP also want to achieve that kind of epic fail. This is why the data computes that subscriber numbers are down.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 01:45:00 -
[9]
Originally by: thedeathxx so basically drone region will be a top region again, and russians will dominate all eve. (personally ill learn russian or quit eve) there will be even more bots doing belts ( since belt ratting will not be affected ) there will be less players arround, since not everyone has a creditcard and gtcs are too expensive at local stores (at least thats my problem) regions that are most of the times empty will be totally deserted since everyone will team up for the "big fishes". most of the people that have a plex subscription will quit. people that are funding their pvp eforts by selling plex wownt sell any more since no one has isk to buy them...
I guess no-one from ccp actually plays this game except gm that just log ingame... because you like to screw this game for most of the players
Don't tell anyone but thousands of accounts have been cancelled over the past few months. As I said, I've dropped three and several years ago I only had one, I will be going back to that one.
Originally by: Kalle Demos
Originally by: tempuskai So, here I have recently joined a small alliance, out in null sec, just getting our feet on the ground, and now its all for nothing (in a 0.19 ts system), thanks! Back to high sec then......
That doesnt even make sense, besides theres more ways to make isk in 0.0, botting isnt the only way
Why don't you go bot in NC territory and see how long you last?
Botting isn't the only way, coming out with nonsense for some is.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 01:56:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Halarach To make 0.0 more fun, interessing and populated you must incite to pvp ccp.
Stop speaking about high-end sanctum runners jesus christ. Missioning/ratting is boring as hell and there is nothing to learn, no fun to have, how can you call that high-end.
So you must make it easier to pvp by making it so we don't have to grind hours to pay for a vaga, and by nerfing terrible things like the dramiel which makes affordable t2 ships like, say, the crusader, totally obsolete and useless nowadays.
Basically we want 0.0 to be like providence was until dominion. Small roaming gangs everywhere, great opportunities to solo etc.
The average empire carebear doesn't understand the broken sec status in Delve, nor do they understand the imbalance in moon distribution. They only see people out there making more than they are, which fills them with jealousy. That is what CCP are relying on to support these changes, not rational thought and understanding of the game, because CCP don't understand the game. If they understood the game they've made they'd have rebalanced moons already.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 02:17:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Lord Biscuit Maybe you should leave Jovian space and see what really happens in 0.0 space in the rest of Eve. Last time I checked, people attacked space because they didn't like who lived there for some reason or another. Never know any 0.0 alliance at any time to attack any region for "better rats".
LIES!!
AAA removed CVA for their superb systems, not because they stabbed them in the back.
Also when BoB/IT went on their winter campaign it was because they wanted NC's ratting space, boredom had absolutely nothing to do with it.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 02:38:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Raven Kumamato Marauders can do 3 to 4 sanctums per hour, thats 105 to 140 mil isk plus salvage and loot on the go with Marauder boni.
Fleets of 10+ guys with Zealots/ Muninns and High Alpha BS can finish a sanctum in 3 to 4 minutes incl. warping to next one.
A fleet of 10+ guys running sanctums? Is the game you're playing called lala land online?
Originally by: Hirana Yoshida
2nd-3rd best sites yield the optimal ISK over time in bounties and salvage .. rats are smaller but go down hard and fast. When grinding you don't actually want those big-digit BS that take 2-3 minutes to kill when you have a half value BC that drops in 15secs.
Havens and Hubs earn more than Sanctums? A 240k BC that takes just as long to kill as a 1m bs is not only half of 1m bs but also more worthwhile? Maybe you mean the 140k BC's that can be two-shotted, good to know 140k is half of 800k or 1m.
Conclusion: You need to go back to primary school, basic maths is beyond you.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 03:13:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Renan Ruivo
Originally by: Lili Lu Supercarriers, Drakes, Technetium, coalition blobs or small RMT entitities with renters. None of these get fixed fast enough or at all. Now a CSM that is controlled by the same coalition blocks. Honestly the game is getting boring after 5 years of being here anyway. It's a shame, I was sorta looking forward to Incarna. Now I hardly log in anymore.![Neutral](/images/icon_neutral.gif)
Can i have your stuffs?
What stuffs? It's too busy frothing at the mouth over things it knows nothing about to have stuffz.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 04:58:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Super Whopper on 28/03/2011 05:02:21
Originally by: Liang Nuren While I laugh every time I watch that, it doesn't change the fact that game design by mass hysteria is stupid. ;-)
-Liang
We should let CCP and their data compute it, because last time CCP computed anything they came out with their 18 months comment, lots of bad publicity and a sharp drop in subscriptions.
The last people who have a clue on how to implement change in this game it's CCP. For years idea's have been put forward on how to change the game for the better e.g. moon rebalancing, lvl 4 mission rebalancing, finishing work on FW and WH's, rebalancing guns, etc. but CCP just can't grasp it. No matter how often they're told by CSM and players they just keep on computing.
Sony also computed, how did that work out for them? If total epic fail (death of every MMO) is a good business plan then CCP need to keep going down this road. In a few years and the death of EVE and WoD (CCP are CCP and will be CCP) they'll be able to say: "We didn't want that company anyway".
Originally by: Renan Ruivo Agreed. However, ignoring the public reaction would be even more stupid. The single most valid argument here is that the proposed changes would simply not achieve the desired effects. They would, in fact, do the exact opposite. Power blocks would become even more entrenched, controlling even more concentrated resources and small alliances would have an even harder time settling in.
People used to get by before dominion, but thats not whats in discussion here. CCP Greyscale wants to clean his house by using a bucket full of mud.
If you look at subscriptions you'll see that there was a sharp rise when CCP released Tyranis. Since then we've had a decline. While people got on just 'fine' before anomalies there weren't this many people playing.
Go back to those days and people will leave for other games, especially those who can't pay for the game through any other mean than Plex. Clever? Only if losing money is clever as a business model.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 05:57:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Frodo Teabaggins kinda like tech moons right?
no, what needs to happen is CCP needs to not listen to players' bias and make the damn game harder.
Indeed, CCP need to make the game really hard and losses need to hurt badly. That way EVE can be turned into a hard core game for a hard core community of gamers.
When the game's dropped from 40k online to less than 10 you will realise how bad your idea is.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 12:06:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Super Whopper on 28/03/2011 12:12:15
Originally by: Clavius XIV While 0.0 should be more lucrative than empire due to the risks, the main draw of 0.0 is the ability for players to strike out into the unknown and make their mark on the cluster without the shackles of Concord, not its ISK value. There was plenty of conflict in 0.0 before anomalies went in and there will be plenty in "worthless" regions if the proposed changes go through. There are small groups fighting all over New Eden to be the top dog in some backwater lowsec system. Providence was far and away the most populated and developed null-sec region pre-Dominion, with crap NPCs and moons, and there was plenty of PvP action to be had. Clearly Providence residents did not have access to the riches that anyone with sov and an ihub does now. Despite it being one of the consistently most violent regions residents still managed to replace ships. So counter arguments based around being unable to afford PvP have little merit from where I sit. I guarantee that if you make vast tracts of 0.0 "worthless" in the pre-Dominion Provi sense, you will still have people staking a claim there. These people will still (as-always) be at the mercy of the big powers knocking over their sand-castles. The difference will be there will be much less incentive for powers to fill that space with renters after knocking the sand-castles over. So called "little" corps/alliances in this thread worry they won't have a chance in null sec because they won't be able to make their rent? They could grab this "worthless" space that supposedly no one would want and save on rent! I do agree that CCP really don't understand their game so this is a right change for the wrong reasons. The reason for the influx of people to 0.0 is not because there is suddenly more isk to be made there. The reason for the increase in 0.0 population is that current mechanics provide an incentive for the great powers to offer security in exchange for rental fees. Unfortunately the double edged sword of making all space desirable rental property, is that you reduce the diversity and quality of conflict in 0.0. The best conflicts are ones in which both sides are in the same class, and where numbers on both sides allow it to be playable. Sov battles between two renters of neighboring superpowers will inevitably escalate into full block warfare. Lots of "worthless" space allows what some may term "cripple fights" and encourages gathering of coalitions of the same "class" rather than a superpower that can maintain balance with other superpowers and it's sea of renters. Yes NAPs and power blocks will always remain in a sandbox game, but all space being equal value (combined with the ease of projecting power, and the ability to knock over empires in a fortnight) encourages power blocks to grow as long as they can find renters to fill their conquests. Making space "worthless" to top tier power blocks encourages the formation of more independent middle and low tier blocks. Mix that with making projection of force more difficult and you have things going in the right direction as far as encouraging variety in 0.0 conflict.
So right. People move out to 0.0 to mine veldspar, because it's unavailable in high sec ![Rolling Eyes](/images/icon_rolleyes.gif)
When a 10k man entity has the choice to fight over sanctums or moons they're going to choose sanctums, because you can really fund a cap fleet with ratting.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 12:08:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Wabs
Originally by: CCP Greyscale Hey everyone,
It'd be pretty difficult not to notice the fairly strong negative reaction this blog's getting so far, and any time this sort of reaction occurs it's pretty common policy for us to take a pause and do another evaluation pass on the design, taking into account the arguments raised by players. Obviously we're in the middle of fanfest right now so everything takes a little longer than usual, but I'm going to talk to some people tomorrow, get some other perspectives, and figure out whether or not we're still happy with both the direction and the details here.
We are starting to take another serious look at a range of nullsec issues right now, with an eye to fixing structural issues with the current design. Be aware that fixing the problems we're facing is very likely going to involve disrupting the current status quo, and in at least some cases I'm expecting us to push through changes we're confident in despite (expected) negative feedback. We have to consider the long-term big picture, and that priority may sometimes conflict with the immediate interests of some elements of the playerbase. That said, this may or may not be one of those occasions - watch this space.
Have a nice weekend everybody, and I'll try and get back to you with more info next week -Greyscale
i totally agree with this! fix it! good job in pushing thru even with the negative response, its better in the long term... ![Smile](/images/icon_smile.gif)
I agree too.
CCP, don't fix guns, don't fix moon imbalance, don't fix the super cap problem (which was created by you), don't fix PI, don't work on WH's, don't work on FW, don't fix BO's, don't fix any of the problems in the game, nerf 0.0 instead.
When enough people have left shareholders will show you lot the exit.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 12:47:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Arnakoz
Originally by: Misanth
Exactly what I'm talking about. You, and the people with your carebear mentality, have taken over the only reasonable isk source that was for combat pilots. Not only that, CCP have made it completely blobtastic and supersafe. It's damn hard for a small group of people to enter an upgraded, usually crowded, system, probe and hit dscan same time to try pin which anomaly they are in.
so you're effectively saying that them playing smarter shouldn't be rewarded? that people who are just like "weeee pew pew weeeeee" and ignore all other aspects of the game should be the ones to get the rewards? look, the simply fact of the matter is that people who have more ISK will win. there is no way to change that. how do you get more isk? you do isk-making activities; a.k.a. what we've dubbed carebearing.
to me the entire point of null is acquire space which can make you massive amounts of isk, but you have to defend. which sounds exactly like the status quo. alliances grow, they need new space, they go after the nearest neighbor whom they dislike. no matter how the dynamic changes this will be the simple truth. at some point this will even happen within the NC. i know some of you would like that sooner than later, but maybe try finding a way of winning that doesn't involve CCP doing it for you.
I, too, would like to find a way of playing EVE without ever having to log on, because logging on involves CCP doing it for me (providing me with tools to play the game the way I feel like).
But it seems you have found a way of doing exactly this. Do tell how you do it.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 13:20:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Arnakoz Edited by: Arnakoz on 28/03/2011 13:11:31
Originally by: Super Whopper
I, too, would like to find a way of playing EVE without ever having to log on, because logging on involves CCP doing it for me (providing me with tools to play the game the way I feel like).
But it seems you have found a way of doing exactly this. Do tell how you do it.
eh, ... ok. i'm not sure where you are going with that, or what it has to do with the topic at hand.
maybe you;re trying to say that the mere fact that you can log on to play is CCP winning for you?? if so, then you're probably good with people just playing like "hey, CCP give me lots of ISK please!" and them doing it. but rather, they have to "[find] a way of winning that doesn't involve CCP doing it for [them]." much like i suggested.
but if you're talking about my specific lack of activity over the past few months: i play occasionally, but started an entire new career recently, in software, when my education is in structural engineering. so eve hasn't been high on my priorities. i fiond a few minutes here and there to troll the forums, but playing takes larger chucks of time than i've had. now that i'm more comfortable with my work i'm getting back into it though. i'll be sure to say hi if i see you ![Cool](/images/icon_cool.gif)
edit: besides, i'm still not sure how, in either case, it has to do with the topic of this thread.... ?
If you have no idea what it's got to do with the topic at hand why did you say "winning it for us?"
You've, obviously, never been to 0.0 and are just making claims based on reading things, rather than empirical evidence. You're obviously jealous of those who run sanctums, so, why don't you stop being jealous and join them?
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Posted - 2011.03.28 13:38:00 -
[20]
LOLProvidence. The only reason nobody wanted it was because it was absolute and utter **** space. Now it'll go back to being that **** space but as there're sov bills and rent on stations to be paid I wonder who will want it. I certainly wouldn't want to waste my time on worthless belts and ore, especially as there're no moons in Providence worth having.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 13:41:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Arnakoz again, completely lost. i've lived in null about 10 months now. first in atlas space now in NC space. every post i've made has been against this change for that very reason. plus i think it will make most of null the new lowsec; unused.
and when i say "winning it for us" i mean all of the people who are like "yes! this change must happen to break up the NC!" i'm saying that CCP is the one winning their fight for them, because at that point they don;t even need to log in for it to happen. we clear now?
edit: going to work now. bye!
I thought you meant that Sanctums are what is 'winning the game for us'.
I humbly apologise.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 15:34:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Synderq Did CCP reply to this torrent of abuse, lol?
Yeah, it was a case of "We're pretty daft for not understanding the game but we're going to implement some stupid change anyway, because we're CCP and we're good at not thinking before we do things."
Like we didn't know CCP are daft and have no clue.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 15:54:00 -
[23]
If CCP boosted mining somehow and allowed me to make as much with mining as I do with trading and ratting I'd go back to mining.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 16:04:00 -
[24]
Originally by: MuppetSlayer This is quite possible the dummest idea I have ever read. Thousands of us have invested huge amounts of time, effort and isk to develping 0.0. More new people are moving out to 0.0 than ever before.
What do CCP Do? Make all high sec agents give out max quality missions. Nert 0.0 anomiles making the vast majority of a lot of regions worthless. Moon goo is unaffected so the alliance HC's are happy and the grunts get screwed.
I must say CCP, even more so than usual, is doing the opposite of what the people who live in 0.0 want.
Petition the system and demand your money back. I'd recommend everyone do that.
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Posted - 2011.03.28 23:21:00 -
[25]
Originally by: CCP Greyscale
Originally by: CCP Greyscale Hey everyone,
It'd be pretty difficult not to notice the fairly strong negative reaction this blog's getting so far, and any time this sort of reaction occurs it's pretty common policy for us to take a pause and do another evaluation pass on the design, taking into account the arguments raised by players. Obviously we're in the middle of fanfest right now so everything takes a little longer than usual, but I'm going to talk to some people tomorrow, get some other perspectives, and figure out whether or not we're still happy with both the direction and the details here.
We are starting to take another serious look at a range of nullsec issues right now, with an eye to fixing structural issues with the current design. Be aware that fixing the problems we're facing is very likely going to involve disrupting the current status quo, and in at least some cases I'm expecting us to push through changes we're confident in despite (expected) negative feedback. We have to consider the long-term big picture, and that priority may sometimes conflict with the immediate interests of some elements of the playerbase. That said, this may or may not be one of those occasions - watch this space.
Have a nice weekend everybody, and I'll try and get back to you with more info next week -Greyscale
Hi again,
Update on the above post: we've looked at the concerns brought up here, and done another evaluation pass as mentioned above. The outcome of this is that, while we understand and appreciate that these changes will negatively impact residents in some areas of space in the short term, we feel that on balance they are still likely to result in a noticeably positive overall outcome in the long run. This decision is mainly predicated on the fact that we still have a sufficient degree of confidence in our models of nullsec causality.
We understand that many players have alternate models that predict negative outcomes; we will of course be monitoring developments post-deployment to confirm whether or not things are developing in the way we are predicting, with an eye to modifying the proposed system if we see unexpected negative outcomes occurring, but we don't believe that the arguments raised by players in this thread weaken our model sufficiently to justify changing our plans at this stage.
We appreciate that this decision is not going to be regarded as a positive one by most participants of this thread, and we of course respect your right to continue to express your previously-noted disapproval here in a civil manner.
That's all for today, -Greyscale
The data you have is what you pulled out of your arse. You have no data, you're a liar.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 04:06:00 -
[26]
CCP have just heavily boosted the NC, the drone regions and nerfed everywhere else. Then they, in their utter stupidity, claim this will cause conflict. A few years ago it didn't cause conflict and it won't cause conflict now. But CCP don't know anything about the game, so, they don't remember.
Also CCP don't remember how many people played EVE four years ago. They want to remember that again.
Brace for NGE, CCP's utter contempt for the CSM and the players will only lead to the death of the game.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 04:57:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Super Whopper on 29/03/2011 04:59:30 I really don't understand why you guys are discussing anything with Liang. It's a troll that intends to troll only. It probably lives somewhere in the Drone regions or the NC and is seeing its own income boosted, while everyone else is getting nerfed even more.
The sports comparison shows Liang is just as clueless as CCP. It is supporting the changing of the rules so one side gets a heavy boost while everyone else is burdened with crippling handicaps.
If Liang wanted wars it'd propagate the nerfing of the NC moons, but it's not. It's only for nerfing everyone else's income. Again, Liang is an NC troll, ignore it.
Here's what a corp member showed me. Apparantly it's from some other forum. It's a really good representation of what's going to happen.
Link: 0.0 After CCP anomaly change.
CCP are bankers: boost the wealthy, screw the poor.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 05:04:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Widemouth Deepthroat anyone who disagrees with the carebears/NC is a troll, grub, child molester etc.
Not living in the north and farming for PLEX makes me a carebear. Those stupid carebears, going to work earn a wage so they can pay for their game time. CCP should write their employer and have their income cut ![Rolling Eyes](/images/icon_rolleyes.gif)
Bad troll is really good at saying stupid things.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 05:06:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Evelgrivion Moon Goo is only as valuable as market demand for materials; the reason why Tech 2 Moon Goo is worth so much is because there is high demand for it. It doesn't create any inherent wealth in and of itself. Money ultimately pools into the coffers of industrialists, and moon goo is one of the bigger places it can end up. The net income for moon holders will decrease as the amount of ISK added to the economy shrinks, and a new equilibrium will set in.
That being said, I'm not a fan of moons.
The billions a month R64's earned a few years ago were a figment of our imagination ![Rolling Eyes](/images/icon_rolleyes.gif)
You haven't been playing long, that is obvious.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 05:15:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Super Whopper on 29/03/2011 05:16:46 Doesn't count NPC sov systems in each region
A: 0.0 to -0.2 (no sanctums/havens!) B: -0.3 to -0.4 (probably havens but few or no sanctums) C: -0.5 to -0.6 (slightly worse than now) D: -0.7 to -0.8 (slightly better than now) E: -0.9 to -1.0 (much better than now)
Code:
| Region | A | B | C | D | E | | |----------------------+----+----+----+----+----+-----------| | The Spire | 3 | 9 | 28 | 18 | 14 | DRF (d) | | Cobalt Edge | 7 | 19 | 19 | 10 | 14 | DRF (d) | | Malpais | 8 | 22 | 27 | 34 | 11 | DRF (d) | | Perrigen Falls | 4 | 9 | 39 | 42 | 10 | DRF (d) | | Etherium Reach | 6 | 13 | 37 | 34 | 10 | DRF (d) | | The Kalevala Expanse | 6 | 16 | 19 | 17 | 10 | DRF (d) |
I would like to remind you all.
CCP are REALLY HEAVILY boosting drone regions.
Area's totally getting ****d by CCP:
| Immensea | 20 | 29 | 26 | 9 | 0 | DRF | | Wicked Creek | 22 | 38 | 15 | 7 | 0 | DRF | | Tribute | 27 | 14 | 6 | 7 | 0 | NC | | Impass | 21 | 19 | 7 | 3 | 0 | CAAASEROL | | Cloud Ring | 8 | 2 | 0 | 1 | 0 | NC/DC | | Fade | 2 | 20 | 5 | 0 | 0 | NC | | Providence | 68 | 12 | 0 | 0 | 0 | Ev0ke | | Pure Blind | 58 | 5 | 0 | 0 | 0 | NC/DC |
Fade, Providence and Pure Blind... ![Surprised](/images/icon_surprised.gif)
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Posted - 2011.03.29 05:57:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Imigo Montoya wow... Threadnaught!
First let me make it clear that I barely if ever run anoms, and never because I need the income. I have plenty of ISK coming in from other (all legit) means, and my alliance has access to some of the best truesec around, so these changes will actually benefit me significantly.
I'm in two minds about the changes, because nullsec should be harsh. I can see that a lot of space (ie low value) will become uninhabited like it was before, so there will be a lot more 'wilderness' space to hide in again, rather than the urban sprawl that has come out of Dominion.
But I still have a couple of major concerns as I will detail below:
- This will remove large ISK Drains, which will cause inflation.
- Player/Dev contract
Point 1. IHub upgrades and Sov bills are a major ISK drain that takes cash out of the economy. If it is no longer economically viable to upgrade ~45% of nullsec (anything between 0.0 and -0.25), players will either chose not to or go bankrupt.
If, as CCP Greyscale has said, there would be the same amount of worthwhile anomolies that are concentrated around low truesec, theortically the same amount of ISK will be coming into the economy.
So same ISK coming in, less ISK going out = more ISK in the economy = inflation = bad.
Point 2. I've had this discussion with Ernest Adams before (the Game Designer and co-founder of the International Game Developer's Association, not the baker) and his position is that the game mechanics are a effectively contract between dev and player and should be changed only under the most dire of circumstances and preferrably with player consent. In fact he's writing a thesis on the topic (I'm sure he'd be interested in consulting in this case - well worth the investment if you ask me).
My position was that the devs should make the choice that is best for the game, but I was referring to things like player imbalances (eg benefiting older players "just because"). I can very much see his point.
The changes made in Dominion were the dev's offer, and purchasing of upgrades and paying of bills by players was the acceptance. To completely take that away from large numbers of those (mostly small) alliances without any compensation would be a major breach of trust between the developer and community.
On a seperate note, I'd like to point out to the NC haters who are saying that "it's just the NC carebears who are complaining" that ev0ke, -A-, NC., Intrepid Crossing, Solar Wing, and Shadow of Death are not part of the NC, but all have members expressing their concern/disapproval of these changes for a multitude of reasons.
There is a reason why we've seen a drop in players but CCP can't get it through their thick skulls, even when they have an economist working for them, creating all those pretty QEN's.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 06:30:00 -
[32]
Originally by: mkmin
Originally by: Super Whopper There is a reason why we've seen a drop in players but CCP can't get it through their thick skulls, even when they have an economist working for them, creating all those pretty QEN's.
The CCP economist was an economics teacher. Not an economics policy maker. Fanfest also made it pretty clear that nobody on the developer side listens to him much anyway. And I'd bet money that he doesn't actually play the game. Pretty graphs are neat, but it's looking like the devs that actually play the game must all live in good truesec and spawn their own super caps. Otherwise how could they be so ****ing clueless.
Obviously Mr. Economics Teacher knows enough about economics to make purty graphs.
These nerfs to the majority of EVE are either because devs are clueless, which means they should be fired, or they're idiots, also should be fired. I think it's a combination of both, which is why they are not discussing it with the CSM and are implementing it without consultation with their players.
Once again CCP have proven that the CSM are meaningless. They will discuss AF fourth bonus but not sweeping changes to the game. Thus, they should be FIRED.
I honestly hope the CSM refuse to discuss anything but CCP's arrogance and stupidity when they fly to Iceland.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 09:05:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Hirana Yoshida *Raises hand* Although not in Sanctums, the one size down yields much better ISK/hour .. double bonus for more cruiser sized modules which has better ISK/m3 and being able to run them in a PvP fit HAC/T3. In short: Your grinding/ratting leaves something to be desired.
100m/Hour Farming Havens? LOL, nice try but total fail, unless you run these havens with the 10 hacs mentioned a few pages ago.
Originally by: Kalle Demos You do know CCP ONLY introduced these anoms in Dominion yeah, you have only had these bot havens just over a year AND 0.0 never even gained any population, removing them would hardly result in losing players.
This will also stop the supercap mass production and FINALLY kills will mean something, if you have a problem with this ask your leaders for better space, but dont complain to CCP about making space worth something.
Next you will say "its unfair that Jita has more more activity than Amarr", EVE isnt fair and was NEVER meant to be balanced, you have an issue take it up with Kim Jong Lau NOT CCP!!
Besides you will still make alot of ISK in 0.0 from other sources, not everyone needs to bot.
The amount of players has also dropped. Guess what that means? Also there're more people in 0.0 now than ever before.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 09:09:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Jita Tradedrone being of a small renter alliance, who probably wont be able to pay the rent after the change. my sentiments are perfectly voiced in what an alliance member said about the change and why it will fail.
Quote: The big guys WILL go there and swat them for lols. You know it. I know it and the big guys know it. They have enough bored SC or cap pilots to do it. So unless they somehow massively nerf the number advantage and cap advantage it wont do diddly to help anyone take "worthless" space.
Worthless space will just result in being worthless again as it was before dominion. why because its worthless again. Too bad CCP fails to see this.
But you miss the bigger picture. The people living in that ****ty space will take their fleet(corp) and move to better space (Motsu), farm the sanctums (lvl 4's), then take their blob to even better space (WH's?) and take that space, right? It has to be, CCP said so, because CCP know best.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 09:13:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Lenthall Scorpus Let's analise a region like Providence
Before Dominion it was a worthless piece of space where CVA carved a hard existence and made noobs come to learn the PVP trade, Dominion hit and the region actually became worth something. Did CVA lose the space because of a new "perceived" value, no they where stupid and poked a bear with a twig and lost there space.
Now you have a few alliances in there that is facing a real threat to there member's existence since they cant do farming and guess what, Provi is going back too being .... wait for it.... useless.
Providence will be even more worthless, as there're sov bills that will need to be paid. But they'll be paid with their super moons... no wait, all those moons are in the north.
Now if only CCP Noobscale and his merry band of clueless elves could grasp that.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 09:38:00 -
[36]
Edited by: Super Whopper on 29/03/2011 09:40:55
Originally by: Jita Tradedrone yes but of course. we will take our 1.5 carrier, 3 bs's and 5 drakes and go and claim better spaces! The fact they can easily field as many caps as we have members doesnt withhold us.. /sarcasm
Personally I thought my sarcasm was pretty easy to read, considering better space became Motsu and sanctums were lvl 4's.
Originally by: Marconus Orion I bet not a single player that has threatened to quit because of this change actually does.
Also let us not forget this is not the only change that will happen. So going all ape **** over one of several changes to come is a bit over the top.
/gets afk cloak alt ready to put in one of the overcrowded future sanctum systems w/ cov cyno...
Going from six accounts to five and then to three is great going for CCP. I never said I'd quit. I've said all along I'll just drop another account or two.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 09:42:00 -
[37]
Edited by: Super Whopper on 29/03/2011 09:44:03
Originally by: Jita Tradedrone Edited by: Jita Tradedrone on 29/03/2011 09:40:33
Originally by: Super Whopper
Originally by: Jita Tradedrone yes but of course. we will take our 1.5 carrier, 3 bs's and 5 drakes and go and claim better spaces! The fact they can easily field as many caps as we have members doesnt withhold us.. /sarcasm
Personally I thought my sarcasm was pretty easy to read, considering better space became Motsu and sanctums were lvl 4's
i know, and i have seen and i have appreciated your sarcasm :D i just ended the sarcasm ![Laughing](/images/icon_lol.gif)
Sorry, I misunderstood.
Well, look mate. If you're clever you'll take your corp, set tax to 110%, build like 9 Titans each and then go and take some space.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 10:57:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Spurty Although I don't believe this change is that much of a game changer, if this thread gets to 50 pages, I'll be changing my mind lol.
Go for it CCP.
This *change* has clearly created 'friction' at some level.
Its doubtful it'll boil into war and fracturing of mega-alliances but may cause a deflation in the numbers of their membership who aren't there because they like the people they are playing with, but for the access to lucrative space.
Friction between players and CCP? Definitely.
Friction between players in the game? I can really see the drone regions turning into a major war zone the moment this goes live, because people really fought massive, endless wars over that area before the drone nerf ![Rolling Eyes](/images/icon_rolleyes.gif)
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Posted - 2011.03.29 11:24:00 -
[39]
Edited by: Super Whopper on 29/03/2011 11:25:00
Originally by: nubos I doubt it that there is any force in eve, capable of attacking drone regions - even nc failed. And after that change of anomalies, drone regions gonna be unstoppable lol
Don't tell CCP, they might get a clue.
Originally by: Admiral Goberius a bloo bloo bloo this is what you get for nerfing nanos
0wned
- Gob
Domi's going faster than inties really has some relation to anom nerf.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 12:05:00 -
[40]
The moment CCP rebalances moons, guns and all the other glaring problems with EVE is when I'll shut up. Months ago CCP said they were looking at these problems, 6 months+ later and a lot has changed...
You're new to EVE, stay a while and you'll see the incompetence that is CCP.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 13:07:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Cyrus Doul If you are talking about my three guys it was 2 carriers with sentry drone damage augmentator rigs, Highs had 3 dcus a piece. Pretty maxxed drone skills. I was dropping 26 t2 sentries (i.e More then a supercarrier) as they do better then fighters as fighters are slow when the bs orbit you and they have to fly back and forth before applying damage where the sentrys just kill and switch instantly. Then the third guy was buzzing around in a Cormorant with a pair of capital shield transfers repping him just in case the rats wanted to be smart and shoot something they could actually kill. the sanctums had a payout of approx 25-30 mil per and the Angel Salvage is insane. You could get along the lines of 12 to 16 million per site with good skills due to trit bar / armour plate drops. With the carriers in the site with me I had a 20k m3 box to store regular loot in too. That adds up too but no where near as much as the salvage. The blood ones in Period basis do a lot better then NC ones too as they dont drop the trit bars as much but you get a lot of armour plates Gurista sanctums suck compared to those.
Also the wallet updates every 20 minutes. And I didnt have to compete for sanctums as I was pretty much the only member on at the time. So warp in. clear, warpout, hit scan and right back in.
If you want to carebear most effectively at this point join mother Russia.
100/3=33
Someone could put 10 miners in a belt then claim he's making 300m/hour. He's still only making 30m/account.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 14:55:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Rakshasa Taisab With the bot-nerfs coming, I can quite easily see how the rents can be quite hard to achieve.
LOL stopped reading after this. You really think CCP can stop the bots ![Laughing](/images/icon_lol.gif)
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Posted - 2011.03.29 15:05:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Cyrus Doul starburst is a contradiction too! CVA would retake provi in a heart beat. It's their mother land and i doubt they care about 5 billion a month in so fees plus whatever they put in strat mod wise. When we rolled it originally every other system had a CSAA tower in there. The ones paying the bills were definately not doing it with ratting... Did the math. To cyno gen, CSAA and JB all 84 systems cost 37 billion, thats 1 titan worth of profit per month. 7 or so for motherships. and we all know that those things sell like hotcakes.
Enjoy paying sov bills on all those stations, as originally was years ago.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 16:17:00 -
[44]
Edited by: Super Whopper on 29/03/2011 16:23:23
Originally by: Cyrus Doul Wait there were sov bills on the stations? I thought they just worked like a tower did. i know with the current system you dont pay anything extra for them. i owned three in provi, and one in period basis and still only got charged 2 mil per day per system.
Originally, when you owned those stations, several years ago, the system was different to what it is now.
Now you pay rent on stations. If you don't you lose the station. CVA shrank from holding most of the space to holding very few systems and stations. Dropping a station in every system was a good idea at the time, now you do it to bankrupt yourself, or if you really need it.
Someone once calculated how much it would cost CVA to maintain all those useless stations and it came to a lot more than they were earning. We were all waiting for CVA to lose all their stations, which they didn't.
Originally by: bitters much Edited by: bitters much on 29/03/2011 15:53:30 Edited by: bitters much on 29/03/2011 15:51:32 For all you little whiners:
Take a look at older alli maps and wonder how all these small alliances managed to grab some space without the endless stream of mindless rats spawning out of thin air outside of belts.
Have a look in CAOD for the old maps yourself and stop the tears please...
To all the clueless: moon distribution was different then.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 23:38:00 -
[45]
Originally by: White Tree Should these changes go through, it will likely not stop larger Alliances from holding regions from which profit can be extracted via the moons. Especially if the profit is large enough to warrant keeping the space, which in the case of certain R64 types: it is.
We'll have to see how this works out.
When was the last time CCP iterated on anything in the game, or kept their word? If CCP continued 'development' it'd be the first time.
You are delusional if you think CCP are actually going to monitor anything, and then make changes.
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Posted - 2011.03.29 23:42:00 -
[46]
Edited by: Super Whopper on 29/03/2011 23:43:57
Originally by: Sig Sour Its been a long time since we have seen this kind of rage... Falcon nerf was it?
If history tells us anything, this kind of rage usually means the game is getting better.
Yeah, like the sharp drop in max concurrent players EVE's been experiencing, for the better.
More ISK in the game, yet fewer players.
When you've realised those players have left, despite being able to pay for their game time with PLEX/market GTC, because this is CCP we're talking about is when you realise CCP only know how to ruin things; they have never, ever iterated on anything they've released. According to their data polishing content won't bring in new players. Keep computing, while players leave.
CCP solving lag by solving their excess profit.
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Posted - 2011.03.30 04:07:00 -
[47]
Edited by: Super Whopper on 30/03/2011 04:09:34
Originally by: Liang Nuren
Originally by: Pesadel0
![Laughing](/images/icon_lol.gif)
-Engine trails -Cyno efects -FW
-pesadel0
http://www.eveonline.com/en/incursion/features
Looks like a whole lot of iteration to me. ![Rolling Eyes](/images/icon_rolleyes.gif)
FW WH's Gun rebalancing AF fourth bonus Moon rebalancing etc. etc. etc.
![Rolling Eyes](/images/icon_rolleyes.gif)
CCP making an 'iteration' after years of having been told about it gives hope that if this anom nonsense doesn't work out the way they are hoping it will (when was the first time something had its intended consequence?) they might fix it by 2020, and even then we'll have clueless noobs like CCP Failscale coming out with the same arrogant nonsense.
Once again I'll end my post with the drop in subscriptions.
Serenity, the future of Tranquility.
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![Super Whopper Super Whopper](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1630648602/portrait?size=64)
Super Whopper
I can Has Cheeseburger
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Posted - 2011.03.30 05:15:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Desert Ice78
Originally by: Klam Another thing that's quite telling of this mess...
Anyone else just get the recent newsletter?
There's a list in it of the March dev blogs... this dev blog isn't in there. More hiding this change from the Eve community. First it's not discussed with the CSM, now it's not published in the newsletter. Very shady.
This. Just got the Newsletter. Did they honestly think we wouldn't notice?
:Greyscale walks away whistling innocently:
Who cares about the newsletter? They hid this from the CSM.
They have no respect for players and our idea's. If they did we'd have had moon rebalancing, we'd have had our engine trails, cyno effect, we'd have had FW worked on, WH's would have been finished. But CCP are too busy patting themselves on the back to notice they're losing customers.
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![Super Whopper Super Whopper](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1630648602/portrait?size=64)
Super Whopper
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Posted - 2011.03.31 15:59:00 -
[49]
Originally by: DarthMopp Edited by: DarthMopp on 31/03/2011 09:02:12 Edited by: DarthMopp on 31/03/2011 08:53:10
Originally by: Kovid
I'd like to see someone admit that there is no realistic way to get caught in a sanctum in alliance held territory with intel networks, or hell just look at local and warp out. for someone who is paying attention. This is nullsec right?
Right. This is nullsec. And yes, given the fact that the pilot is not a complete moron and at least has an eye on Local then he is pretty safe in an Anomaly. (Blue Tackles left aside..as well as those morons ratting in Caps and Supercaps)
I really think that most of the complaining does originate from the way CCP want to sell this nerf to us. Couldnt they just say "Hey...the Faucet/Sink Gap is way too ****ing huge. One problem to solve this is to remove Sanctums and Havens from crappy truesec, the other solution will be to nerf the mission Agents in HighSec. We are sorry about that but theres no other way at the moment."
Some more honesty would be awesome.
Nonsense. The reason why CCP are doing this is in the hope more people buy and sell PLEX. The more people buy and sell PLEX the more money CCP make. This is why it wasn't discussed with the CSM. CCP can see they are bleeding customers and money but instead of improving the game they are set on releasing unfinished content that never gets iterated on, because their data tells them it's better to be stupid and lose customers than do things differently.
I have no idea where management get these idiots from but they'll be in for a shareholder revolt in a while if they don't change their strategy.
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![Super Whopper Super Whopper](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1630648602/portrait?size=64)
Super Whopper
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Posted - 2011.04.01 10:20:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Erichk Knaar So, we've established that currently, anoms are netting ~45m-alot ISK/hr. We've established that a lot of people are angry about them making ~10m-20m ISK/hr.
I'll ask this. Seeing as how the really expensive stuff is all moongoo paid, and most of the current conflict in Eve involves Drakes and sh*tfit Maels, what exactly are you lot doing with all this ISK now?
I don't really see any 'big projects' going on. Just sitting there looking pretty in your wallet?
Anoms earn 45m/hour? We have established anoms earn 150m/hour. If you're going to make nonsense up at least make something up to promote your pointless cause.
Building Titans and MS are what? Good to know the ISK used to buy and build them are in alliance leaders wallets. Next time you see a fleet of super caps remind yourself they're not there, the money was never used.
Liang and this nub are the definition of trolls. By picking some random numbers, false statements and making personal attacks they are not here to discuss anything, they're just here to antagonise.
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![Super Whopper Super Whopper](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1630648602/portrait?size=64)
Super Whopper
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Posted - 2011.04.01 10:57:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Lost'In'Space
Originally by: Super Whopper Anoms earn 45m/hour? We have established anoms earn 150m/hour. If you're going to make nonsense up at least make something up to promote your pointless cause.
If that is sarcasm, then what is the right number for farming anoms in fully upgraded system?
I'd say 30m is about average. 45 Million is possible but you're looking at expensive ships with even more expensive fittings.
When an arbitrary number like 45 is used it doesn't mean they are talking about the average person, they're talking about billions in fittings and faction or T2 BS, or T3.
I have seen people flying Navy Ravens with 2b in fittings turn into pretty KM's because they got caught by hostiles, so, the average player isn't going to sit in an anom with billions in fittings, they'd rather do that in Motsu or Dodixie.
Originally by: Renan Ruivo Sorry, the only ones who manage to pull off 150m/h witha anomalies are those who run with two or three carriers, or two carriers and one T3, or one super... you catch my drift.
If your average grunt can pull 60m/h, then he's doing VERY nice.
Sarcasm - Brittanica
150 Million ISK per hour with carriers? More like 10 Zealots.
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![Super Whopper Super Whopper](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1630648602/portrait?size=64)
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Posted - 2011.04.01 11:01:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Sarina Rhoda 45m an hour per toon is actually quite a realistic figure i think for your average alliance grunt. I used to farm sanctums up in catch dual boxing a t2 fitted with max skills ishtar and geddon.
Both toons combined i used to make 100m/hr. My biggest isk bounty cycle i believe was 18.5m on each toon so 37m per 20mins which = 111m/hr but that was only if i was really focused on what i was doing.
I spent ages trying different ships/fittings but short of high isk pimping / using carrier + faction bs i could not get my IPH up any higher.
edited - messed up the quote :(
That 18.5 you got was including an expensive faction rat you got.
I have lived in Catch and you're lying.
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Super Whopper
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Posted - 2011.04.02 10:30:00 -
[53]
Originally by: mkmin Yeah, there's a 3rd party piracy/griefer forum that CCP takes more seriously than it's own forums. That's who they are catering to. That's where they got the idea from.
SHC are trolling CCP so hard CCP haven't got a clue, which isn't abnormal. But CCP wouldn't even listen to them. Look up the "Will it won't it" Technetium thread. It was foretold there that CCP were making a mistake, but CCP are too busy with their heads up each others arses.
SHC is usually a good place for discussion but discussions are usually heavily influenced by idiots who haven't played EVE for years, and haven't got a clue what they're talking about. To be honest they aren't the idiots, they're the trolls, the idiots are the people who listen to these trolls.
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![Super Whopper Super Whopper](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1630648602/portrait?size=64)
Super Whopper
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Posted - 2011.04.02 12:40:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Evelgrivion Scrapheap is worth more than posting like this for exactly one reason: Players can see past the scope of their personal, corporation, or alliance's in game wallet and assets list.
Obviously, most of them don't play the game anymore, so, they have no alliance or personal game, wallet to look past.
And the thread was good, until bitternubs like Marlona and Malcanis started posting. Most of their posts nowadays are just drivel, trolling out of boredom, rather than contributing anything of value. Whatever makes them happy, but don't come here and say their opinions are of any value.
When there's something decent to be discussed they can be quite intelligent but in cases like this the low sec trolls crawl out of their caves and start spamming nonsense.
The only thing they are right about is people claiming they're quitting. But even then they pretend their way of gaming is the only possible way, which is why they're as ignorant as it gets.
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Super Whopper
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Posted - 2011.04.05 07:45:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha This is the typical hi sec bear mentality at work.
CCP owes you NOTHING. You saw the glittering of Klondike/0.0 and accepted the challenge. You collectively HAD nine trillions handed to you and other renters in a quarter. You made probably more 9 trillions in this quarter. Now CCP decided to pull the ISK fountain off.
It's been good till it lasted, you are not entitled to anything. The EULA itself has it written.
ITT: paying for a product doesn't mean you actually get it, unless you have access to Technetium.
I'd like to thank the people on SHC. May my name live on in infamy, while you revel in your bitter elitism. Your own arrogance, and inability to have a discourse on this matter (too busy not playing this game) have made yourselves irrelevant.
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![Super Whopper Super Whopper](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1630648602/portrait?size=64)
Super Whopper
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Posted - 2011.04.05 09:10:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Quote: ITT: paying for a product doesn't mean you actually get it, unless you have access to Technetium
The "paying customer" and "paying product" is another typical pattern exhibited when CCP nerfed L4 loot and the affected bears flooded the forums.
Anyway you pay the right to spend TIME in the game, the content is solely property of CCP and they do whatever they want with it. You signed it.
You are so right, just because we 'signed' some arbitrary document it means they can do as they wish.
So, how about we leave this game, because it's 'theirs' anyway and let them play their game themselves. It's 'theirs' after all, made by them for themselves.
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![Super Whopper Super Whopper](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1630648602/portrait?size=64)
Super Whopper
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Posted - 2011.04.05 09:17:00 -
[57]
Originally by: BIZZAROSTORMY Ill post this again because a lot of people are making the same mistake.
This mass-nerf has nothing to do with isk sinks or faucets - nothing to do with income, nothing to do with deflation or inflation.
CCPs stated reason for the nerf is to increase goodfights. This was clearly stated in black and white. All other considerations are moot points.
So does ANYONE think this will increase 0.0 warfare? I rest my case.
It has nothing to do with 0.0 warfare. It's about selling PLEX, nothing more, nothing less. If CCP wanted more wars they'd rebalance Technetium, but they don't want that, they just want to sell more PLEX and earn more fiat currency.
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Posted - 2011.04.07 14:24:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Danastar
just for informaton:
Angel Sanctums/Havens have 1.1/1.2 mil BS
using 1 thanatos, you'll get abt 60-90 mil/h. Depends on how lazy you are and if you have fast access to free anoms
2 thanatoses will get you in 90-120 mil/h range
1 thanny + nyx and you are in 120-150 mil/h range
2 nyxes equals 150-180 mil/h
Good combo is thanny + machariel also, but havent tried it as it requires more efforts and control.
These numbers, again, are for Angel anomalies and with 10% corp tax. Ratting in Pure Blind for instance will get you less isk/h ratio as the BS there have worse bounty.
P.S. I... am... liar.
Fixed and yes, you are a liar. Running sanctums with two carriers does not earn you 60-90m/hour.
Originally by: Danastar somehow i dont believe you :)
And I somehow don't believe you, not in the least because you're trying to show off your epeen by lying.
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Posted - 2011.04.07 14:26:00 -
[59]
Originally by: End User well it's my first day playing since the changes, I made 100m isk in high sec running level 4 missions which is a good deal less then I could heave made running sanctums.... talking to some of my alliance mates it seems like we are losing people to bigger alliances who hold better space. looks like this patch is turning out to a kick in the teeth for the little guy. yeah I know people laugh about farming sanctums but it's not as if CCP is removing them from the game, just giving them to alliances who are large enough to hold the best space and taking them away from the small fry who live on the fringes. good job CCP.
LIES! CCP said this patch would help the little guy and it is helping them, because the gospel according to CCP says so (in other words it's helping people back to empire).
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Posted - 2011.04.07 14:30:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Malcanis
Originally by: Kentai Samica Thanks CCP
We are a small corp that rents from AAA and live in 2 systems ranging from -0.35 to -0.43. We no longer have sanctums just a single haven and some hubs.
After your patch around 30%-40% of our members are no looking at 3 options.
1. Join a major power block alliance that has access to systems with 6-8 sanctums. 2. Return to empire and try level 4 misisons. 3. Give up and try another game.
So much for increasing conflict and providing the motive for smaller groups to take better space.
How do you expect a newer corp to keep members and make enough isk to even consider planning a sov campaign when our members are joining the huge blob alliances, leaving to empire or quitting game?
Look at this guy pretending that there's no other way to make ISK than to farm Sanctums.
Look at him! ![Rolling Eyes](/images/icon_rolleyes.gif)
Look at him feel hurt that CCP are implementing an ill out thought idea (like there is any other way of doing things when it comes to EVE) and hurting his play style.
Look at him! ![Rolling Eyes](/images/icon_rolleyes.gif)
Troll harder ![Rolling Eyes](/images/icon_rolleyes.gif) ![Rolling Eyes](/images/icon_rolleyes.gif)
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